All scribes by Joel Cooper27 February 2008
25 February 2008
1. CULTURE AND ART ARE FOR EVERYONE
Margate Open Space Event Group 1
Session 1
Culture and art are for everyone. How do we engage all communities? This is not just for artists – it’s for all.
Discussion led by Carla Wenham-Jones
Key discussion points/themes:
- Elitism within the arts & culture: 
importance of ownership; engagement; accessibility.
- Communication: on local and national levels; its role in raising awareness; source of information.
- The case for arts & culture specifically in Margate: history/heritage; funding; sustainability.
- Public/local engagement: making use of local resources; cultural diversity within Margate.
- Entrepreneurial opportunities within Margate: their link to arts & culture.
Action points:
1. Eliminate elitist status of arts & culture and ensure its sustainability – address exclusion and lack of engagement in arts & culture.
2. Use of multiple media forms for access and communication (e.g. website devoted to Margate’s arts & culture, as well as alternative non-internet based forms of communication).
3. Key role of Turner Contemporary in establishing Margate’s arts & culture scene and its use in effective communication.
4. Funding – seek alternative sources, also bearing in mind future sustainability.
2. GALLERY SPACE FOR LOCAL ARTISTS
Margate Open Space Event Group 1
Session 2
Discussion led by Bill Pitt
Key discussion points/themes:
- Lack of available/suitable/affordable work space for artists in Margate (and Thanet as a whole)
- Thorough discussion on Harbour Arms and the possibilities it displays in addressing the lack of artists’ work space
- Is there a market for art work in Thanet?
- The Turner Contemporary’s and UCCA’s key role in addressing these issues
- Definitions of ‘affordable work space’ and ‘local artists’
Action points:
1. Identify what is public and what is private available space for artists (in Margate and Thanet)
2. Make use of Harbour Space (they are currently working on an open agenda)
3. Affordability linked to planning use of space
4. Seminars for artists to learn how to negotiate space. Give skills, not space. (note: Businesslilnk in collaboration with UCCA have done this in the past)
5. Identify external funding sources
6. Develop a mechanism for interacting with local authority to influence planning process
7. Bring abandoned properties back for artists to use
Session 2
Discussion led by Bill Pitt
Key discussion points/themes:
- Lack of available/suitable/affordable work space for artists in Margate (and Thanet as a whole)
- Thorough discussion on Harbour Arms and the possibilities it displays in addressing the lack of artists’ work space
- Is there a market for art work in Thanet?
- The Turner Contemporary’s and UCCA’s key role in addressing these issues
- Definitions of ‘affordable work space’ and ‘local artists’
Action points:
1. Identify what is public and what is private available space for artists (in Margate and Thanet)
2. Make use of Harbour Space (they are currently working on an open agenda)
3. Affordability linked to planning use of space
4. Seminars for artists to learn how to negotiate space. Give skills, not space. (note: Businesslilnk in collaboration with UCCA have done this in the past)
5. Identify external funding sources
6. Develop a mechanism for interacting with local authority to influence planning process
7. Bring abandoned properties back for artists to use
3. MARGATE ROCKS - IS IT IMPORTANT FOR MARGATE?
Margate Open Space Event Group 1
Session 3
Discussion led by Jessica Baum
Key discussion points/themes:
- Margate Rock’s background, importance and future
- How can MR be sustainable?
Action points:
1. Revise programme/budget in light of less funding for this year
2. Crisis meeting with funders
3. Capacity – "Train to Gain" (LSC). Find out who the Train to Gain broker for Margate is and initiate contact
4. Other funding sources/sponsors eg. developers
5. Continue or not?
Session 3
Discussion led by Jessica Baum
Key discussion points/themes:
- Margate Rock’s background, importance and future
- How can MR be sustainable?
Action points:
1. Revise programme/budget in light of less funding for this year
2. Crisis meeting with funders
3. Capacity – "Train to Gain" (LSC). Find out who the Train to Gain broker for Margate is and initiate contact
4. Other funding sources/sponsors eg. developers
5. Continue or not?
4. HOW CAN MARGATE COMPETE AGAINST OTHER SEASIDE TOWNS IN KENT?
Margate Open Space Event Group 2
Session 1
Session 1
Discussion led by Rupert Davis
Key discussion points/themes:
Assets that make Margate unique compared to other towns in East Kent
- ‘Brand’ of Margate
- Geography – sandy beaches, bay, climate, green spaces
- Architecture and compact Old Town
- Cultural community – vibrant local inhabitants, nascent but growing community
- Turner Contemporary – needs to be utilised as a landmark for Margate to draw visitors who will then stay
- Need to preserve affordable space for galleries and artist’s work space to entice more artists to Margate
What Margate is lacking:
- evening economy
- music scene
- series of exciting and accessible events
- amenities such as public toilets and good quality accommodation
- link between the beach and other attractions to draw visitors from the beach into Margate.
- small scale creative industries
- mix of national and independent retailers
- high quality public sector realm
Action Points:
1. A co-ordinated cultural offer is needed to link together towns in East Kent
2. Margate needs a focused, coherent vision of art in the public realm which needs to include a brief for artists applying for funding or answering tenders to connect all artistic input
3. Development money is needed to preserve Margate’s assets, to protect Margate’s unique buildings from conversion into commercial properties, and for the development of Dream Land to conserve the character of Margate
5. EXODUS: HOW DO WE MOVE ON? LESSONS TO BE LEARNT
Margate Open Space Event Group 2
Session 2
Discussion led by Claudia Leaf
Key discussion points/themes:
- Right project / wrong time? Was the risk element too great? Was it the right time for Margate to do an ambitious large scale project when it has good quality small scale local work?
- With the burning of Gormley’s Waste Man, Margate gained no permanent, iconic landmark from the project. The limitations of one-off events has highlighted the need for a permanent piece of public art and a series of 10 or 12 good events per year in order to aid regeneration.
- Problem of the Caroline Deeds Channel 4 documentary Waste Man which focused on the negative aspects of Margate, perpetuating stereotypes and emphasising decay.
- The community has been left with the feeling that the institutions and funding bodies involved did not see the project through to the end. There was no report on the project or public forum to discuss what went wrong so mistakes were never identified and learnt from.
- Margate does not self-promote. Small scale, good quality work taking place in Margate is not being communicated internationally, nationally, or even in Margate.
Action Points:
1. In order for the lessons from Exodus to be put into practice there needs to be a public forum made up of artists and members of the public from all backgrounds to evaluate mistakes.
2. To facilitate learning an artistic network needs to be set up, through proper organisation of the informal one which already exists.
3. A clear, coherent and open artistic strategy needs to be developed to co-ordinate access to funding.
4. Margate needs to develop a marketing strategy to communicate projects both within Margate, nationally and internationally.
Session 2
Discussion led by Claudia Leaf
Key discussion points/themes:
- Right project / wrong time? Was the risk element too great? Was it the right time for Margate to do an ambitious large scale project when it has good quality small scale local work?
- With the burning of Gormley’s Waste Man, Margate gained no permanent, iconic landmark from the project. The limitations of one-off events has highlighted the need for a permanent piece of public art and a series of 10 or 12 good events per year in order to aid regeneration.
- Problem of the Caroline Deeds Channel 4 documentary Waste Man which focused on the negative aspects of Margate, perpetuating stereotypes and emphasising decay.
- The community has been left with the feeling that the institutions and funding bodies involved did not see the project through to the end. There was no report on the project or public forum to discuss what went wrong so mistakes were never identified and learnt from.
- Margate does not self-promote. Small scale, good quality work taking place in Margate is not being communicated internationally, nationally, or even in Margate.
Action Points:
1. In order for the lessons from Exodus to be put into practice there needs to be a public forum made up of artists and members of the public from all backgrounds to evaluate mistakes.
2. To facilitate learning an artistic network needs to be set up, through proper organisation of the informal one which already exists.
3. A clear, coherent and open artistic strategy needs to be developed to co-ordinate access to funding.
4. Margate needs to develop a marketing strategy to communicate projects both within Margate, nationally and internationally.
6. WHOSE CULTURE AND VISION IS IT ANYWAY?
Margate Open Space Event Group 2
Session 3
Discussion led by Phil Oldfield
Session 3
Discussion led by Phil Oldfield
Key discussion points/themes:- The cultural vision for Margate is tied in with institutions, such as the Council, and their vision of culture and regeneration.
- Thanet culture is tied in with the business culture. Art is under economic pressure and is increasingly commercial in order to meet the demands of businesses.
- There is no cohesive idea of what culture is in Margate. It is diverse and formed by people passing through as well as residents. These multiple cultural ideas and diversity are positive but an overarching cultural strategy is also needed.
- Margate needs more risk taking in culture and art – risk taking is the only way to grow, but how do we allow this in our community?
- Lack of belief in Margate by its residents – people no longer perceive its assets and potential. People need to visualise regeneration.
Action Points:
1. Communication – the artistic community needs a voice and there needs to be increased communication between institutions and artists.
2. Have to create a place where businesses and people want to live and increase footfall by use of arts.
3. Margate needs an arts festival with popular icons and popular culture that will engage everyone, including the marginalised.
7. FUTURE FOR ARTIST LED SPACES IN MARGATE
Margate Open Space Event Group 3
Session 1
Discussion led by Limbo
Key discussion points/themes:
- It’s hard to organise local artists
- It’s hard to get funding
- The question was raised: how are artists valued? What does Margate need to be contemporary?
- “Our generation was the backbone for regeneration. Now, 30 years on, we are under threat of regeneration. The worst case scenario is that we are going to be wiped out by regeneration.”
- “The council don’t care about investment and it seems as though they are only interested in investing when they are able to buy the building. Their motive is regeneration and economy, meaning that the artist can’t be sustained.
- People are wanting and demanding different things. Artists are willing to work on commissioned work for nothing- they are clamouring over each other to work for free. This shows that artists are not valued at all. This needs to be recognised and considered before we start producing art for art’s sake.
Action points:
1. Initiatives have to be provided for things to flourish.
2. Artists need to be recognised as one, otherwise there will be conflicting communities. It’s about networking or trying to find a network.
3. Working creatively with people can spark interest and more funding.
4. We need to create a group of like-minded artists to come together on a regular basis.
Session 1
Discussion led by Limbo
Key discussion points/themes:
- It’s hard to organise local artists
- It’s hard to get funding
- The question was raised: how are artists valued? What does Margate need to be contemporary?
- “Our generation was the backbone for regeneration. Now, 30 years on, we are under threat of regeneration. The worst case scenario is that we are going to be wiped out by regeneration.”
- “The council don’t care about investment and it seems as though they are only interested in investing when they are able to buy the building. Their motive is regeneration and economy, meaning that the artist can’t be sustained.
- People are wanting and demanding different things. Artists are willing to work on commissioned work for nothing- they are clamouring over each other to work for free. This shows that artists are not valued at all. This needs to be recognised and considered before we start producing art for art’s sake.
Action points:
1. Initiatives have to be provided for things to flourish.
2. Artists need to be recognised as one, otherwise there will be conflicting communities. It’s about networking or trying to find a network.
3. Working creatively with people can spark interest and more funding.
4. We need to create a group of like-minded artists to come together on a regular basis.
8. YOUTH CULTS
Margate Open Space Event Group 3
Session 2
Discussion led by Nick Dermott
Session 2
Discussion led by Nick Dermott
Key discussion points/themes:- Britain invented youth cults and Margate pioneered the mods and rockers back in the 1960’s. It’s what Margate was known for
- Everyone under the age of 65 belonged to one
- All youth cults have music attached to them: teddy boys, mods and rockers, punks, skin heads, glam rock, new age etc.
- Cult is always evolving and always acquiring new members and young people are apart of the evolving of society.These cults are fundamental to Englishness and we should celebrate cults and differences.
Main idea:
- The idea is to make Dreamland the centre for a 'music museum' showing the history of youth cults and music, and a venue for musicians and bands to come and play music.
- This is something that The Pie Factory- and the Youth Music Action Zone would really like to be a part of.
- There is a very live music scene in Margate e.g. the Lido and Britannia pub are currently venues for presenting new music/acts.
- We think nostalgia in past youth cults could benefit Margate. There is now a mutual respect across the cults and a great level of sophistication in visuals and sounds with youth cults could be provided at dreamland.
- A museum of youth cults is a good way for kids to know what has happened before as it will show the history of music and will help them understand the current gang rivalry situation that is occurring. Also kids will become ‘accidental historians’.
- There is possible funding here and Margate could be an entertainment Mecca!
Action points:
1.The project needs a board, a constitution and an organisation - lets meet asap to start the process
- The idea is to make Dreamland the centre for a 'music museum' showing the history of youth cults and music, and a venue for musicians and bands to come and play music.
- This is something that The Pie Factory- and the Youth Music Action Zone would really like to be a part of.
- There is a very live music scene in Margate e.g. the Lido and Britannia pub are currently venues for presenting new music/acts.
- We think nostalgia in past youth cults could benefit Margate. There is now a mutual respect across the cults and a great level of sophistication in visuals and sounds with youth cults could be provided at dreamland.
- A museum of youth cults is a good way for kids to know what has happened before as it will show the history of music and will help them understand the current gang rivalry situation that is occurring. Also kids will become ‘accidental historians’.
- There is possible funding here and Margate could be an entertainment Mecca!
Action points:
1.The project needs a board, a constitution and an organisation - lets meet asap to start the process
2. Getting Dreamland planning
3. Application for lottery fund
4. Organise a fundraising concert to get things started
3. Application for lottery fund
4. Organise a fundraising concert to get things started
9. SPACE BEYOND BUILDINGS
Margate Open Space Event Group 3
Session 3
Discussion led by Chris Tipping
Key discussion points/themes:
- Bob Geldof recently described Margate as ugly.
- We need to invigorate common spaces in Margate, as these spaces are not defined.
- The biggest thing about Margate is the sea and land and we need to make unison between natural landscape and man made landscape and this could be done with interaction technology.
- The ugliness of the man made landscape detracts from the natural landscape that is beautiful and we have the opportunity to re-engage with it
- If you take away the boundaries you allow people to interact.
- The seafront has the most barriers where there shouldn’t be any. The old town doesn’t have any boundaries and this should be brought to the front.
- Technology could help bring down these barriers by making Margate one big communal space through Intelligent Way Finding. By doing this we can do away with conventional signage. By de-cluttering the landscape people are able to move in an intuitive way.
- There could be a way of using natural landscape to interpret the space. E.g. The sea plays on tides and shifts and natural things could be tied into navigation.
- The question was raised as to if these ideas were far-fetched? The answer was no, as examples of this have been found in Southampton. At the moment Interactive Way Finding is being used that sends information about the area to your phone as you walk by.
- There are two levels that have been addressed here: nature and technology. We need to marry these two together. By taking risks and working towards regeneration, we can be bold and try something different.
- We need to readdress the boundaries between the town and the sea.
- Green landscape tends to be ignored. In the past civic pride was always expressed through seaside gardens. Now we need to evolve that and see the potential in it for the future.
- This could be achieved through our Squares - we have some really fantastic squares such as ‘Hawley’ and ‘Cecil’ so we need to invest in the quality of those spaces. By doing this it could be an investment in the property around it.
- Margate is made up of different areas and this has made it disjointed. There is a need to hold them together through healthier and transitional spaces. When you piece them together they make a substantial space.
Action points:
1. We should start to tackle Cecil Square. By doing this it would make a big statement to the other areas and squares.
2. Civic pride: tackle one area at a time, which can spin out if you do it well!
3. We need to exploit technology in an innovative way.
4. We need to start de-cluttering spaces (e.g. Ashley ring road- once that momentum gets going Margate will feel they can do that too!)
5. Camaraderie is needed and important
6. Someone in authority has to think about what is right for everybody
7. We need watertight research to follow things through that would make a good reference document
It’s very important that this is fun as most areas are successful in regenerating if they can bring children into it. Here is an opportunity to get the energy back!
Session 3
Discussion led by Chris Tipping
Key discussion points/themes:
- Bob Geldof recently described Margate as ugly.
- We need to invigorate common spaces in Margate, as these spaces are not defined.
- The biggest thing about Margate is the sea and land and we need to make unison between natural landscape and man made landscape and this could be done with interaction technology.
- The ugliness of the man made landscape detracts from the natural landscape that is beautiful and we have the opportunity to re-engage with it
- If you take away the boundaries you allow people to interact.
- The seafront has the most barriers where there shouldn’t be any. The old town doesn’t have any boundaries and this should be brought to the front.
- Technology could help bring down these barriers by making Margate one big communal space through Intelligent Way Finding. By doing this we can do away with conventional signage. By de-cluttering the landscape people are able to move in an intuitive way.
- There could be a way of using natural landscape to interpret the space. E.g. The sea plays on tides and shifts and natural things could be tied into navigation.
- The question was raised as to if these ideas were far-fetched? The answer was no, as examples of this have been found in Southampton. At the moment Interactive Way Finding is being used that sends information about the area to your phone as you walk by.
- There are two levels that have been addressed here: nature and technology. We need to marry these two together. By taking risks and working towards regeneration, we can be bold and try something different.
- We need to readdress the boundaries between the town and the sea.
- Green landscape tends to be ignored. In the past civic pride was always expressed through seaside gardens. Now we need to evolve that and see the potential in it for the future.
- This could be achieved through our Squares - we have some really fantastic squares such as ‘Hawley’ and ‘Cecil’ so we need to invest in the quality of those spaces. By doing this it could be an investment in the property around it.
- Margate is made up of different areas and this has made it disjointed. There is a need to hold them together through healthier and transitional spaces. When you piece them together they make a substantial space.
Action points:
1. We should start to tackle Cecil Square. By doing this it would make a big statement to the other areas and squares.
2. Civic pride: tackle one area at a time, which can spin out if you do it well!
3. We need to exploit technology in an innovative way.
4. We need to start de-cluttering spaces (e.g. Ashley ring road- once that momentum gets going Margate will feel they can do that too!)
5. Camaraderie is needed and important
6. Someone in authority has to think about what is right for everybody
7. We need watertight research to follow things through that would make a good reference document
It’s very important that this is fun as most areas are successful in regenerating if they can bring children into it. Here is an opportunity to get the energy back!
10. SIGNAGE TO ART AND CULTURAL HERITAGE SITES
Margate Open Space Event Group 4
Session 1
The use of signage and open space for art and cultural heritage of the Thanet Coast
The use of signage and open space for art and cultural heritage of the Thanet Coast
Discussion led by Malcolm Kirkaldie
Key discussion points/themes:
- Out of date signs
- Internal and external town signage needs work as it is confusing and out of date
- Current signage does not comply with disability accessibility
- An identity is needed for the area - residents are not relating to the space they live in
Action Points:
1. Conduct an audit to identify all out of date signs and where new signage is needed
2. Lobby Thanet District Council, Kent County Council and Kent Highways to make changes to signage
3. Margate Civic Society representative to bring up signage issues with the Property Services Forum
Key discussion points/themes:
- Out of date signs
- Internal and external town signage needs work as it is confusing and out of date
- Current signage does not comply with disability accessibility
- An identity is needed for the area - residents are not relating to the space they live in
Action Points:
1. Conduct an audit to identify all out of date signs and where new signage is needed
2. Lobby Thanet District Council, Kent County Council and Kent Highways to make changes to signage
3. Margate Civic Society representative to bring up signage issues with the Property Services Forum
11. PROTECTING OUR GREEN SPACES
Margate Open Space Event Group 4
Session 2
Discussion led by Margaret Main
Key discussion points/themes:
- Conservation officer for green spaces needed for Thanet
- Too much focus on built environment and not enough on green spaces
- Flower beds and topiary have disappeared in favour of low cost / low maintenance gardens
- Council needs to publicise good works as the public don’t know about some of the positive work that is being done
Action Points:
1. Conservation officer needed at the Council
2. Educate adults and children in conservation - through schools and publicity
3. Small grant fund for green spaces that community groups can bid into
Discussion led by Margaret Main
Key discussion points/themes:
- Conservation officer for green spaces needed for Thanet
- Too much focus on built environment and not enough on green spaces
- Flower beds and topiary have disappeared in favour of low cost / low maintenance gardens
- Council needs to publicise good works as the public don’t know about some of the positive work that is being done
Action Points:
1. Conservation officer needed at the Council
2. Educate adults and children in conservation - through schools and publicity
3. Small grant fund for green spaces that community groups can bid into
12. OPPORTUNITIES AND ACTIVITIES THAT BRING GENERATIONS TOGETHER
Margate Open Space Event Group 4
Session 3
Discussion led by Vera Elliott
Key discussion points/themes:
- Community spirit is missing
- Older people are victims of ageism
- Older people fear the youth
- Make use of established groups to promote exchange of activities
- English culture is not family orientated
Action Points:
1. Mobilise schools and community groups to work together
2. Ensure that this issue is part of the Margate cultural vision
3. Arrange a meeting between Youth Council and Thanet Senior Citizens to make a start on addressing this issue
Session 3
Discussion led by Vera Elliott
Key discussion points/themes:
- Community spirit is missing
- Older people are victims of ageism
- Older people fear the youth
- Make use of established groups to promote exchange of activities
- English culture is not family orientated
Action Points:
1. Mobilise schools and community groups to work together
2. Ensure that this issue is part of the Margate cultural vision
3. Arrange a meeting between Youth Council and Thanet Senior Citizens to make a start on addressing this issue
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